We Cannot Compromise, Even For Nice Guys

I’ll be short and to the point here, because the rest of this post has comments from two friends I want to share.  I have also read some great comments from some of my Facebook friends.  I am a big fan of Glen Beck, politically.  He shares practically all the conservative values I believe in.  He has a strong voice for conservatism, and for Constitutional authority in our laws.  But that’s where it stops for me.  Glenn Beck, by biblical definition, is NOT my brother in Christ.  This past weekend, if I had time and money, I might have gone to his Restoring Honor rally on Saturday.  But I would not have gone to Friday’s event, called America’s Divine Destiny.  This is where we have to draw the line, folks.  The America’s Divine Destiny was just another example of ecumenical holding of hands which according to the Bible, is wrong.  So there it is.  I love Glenn Beck, but I mainly love him because he needs to find the real Jesus.  Let’s pray for him to do that, because all the other worthy accomplishments he manages to do will be worth nothing, unless he finds the one true God and Savior, the Lord Jesus Christ, who is not the Jesus of Mormonism.

Here are some thoughts on this from Mike:

The Divine Destiny event was especially religious in nature, and also very ecumenical. Sadly, we had a devout Mormon essentially leading many evangelicals, as well as many of other faiths, in basically a Christian (worship) service. I am the treasurer in a local tea party group. I have firmly believed in the tea party movement’s desire to get our government back to the Constitution and electing officials of character who believe in conservative principles and live by them. Many in the tea party movement are evangelical Christians. However, people in this country are getting so desperate for leaders who can help in restoring America that they are throwing discernment, if they had it to start with, out the window. I believe most all conservative Christians backed Glen Beck when he was only speaking politics and our nation’s history and principles, but it needed to stop there. But now that a cult member has moved to the forefront of spiritual leadership, we are in bigger trouble than ever. God will not honor those who compromise truth, no matter how worthy the goal. Fortunately some evangelicals are speaking up and standing for truth, and we need to stand with them. Only by holding to the Word of God can we avoid being deceived. I fear for our nation and our church, and we are all just doing a small part, which I believe God will honor if we hold to His Word, and keep Christ first, and country second.

Many blessings,
Mike

From Pastor Ken Silva at Apprising Ministries:

THE JESUS OF GLENN BECK

By Ken Silva pastor-teacher on Aug 27, 2010

Being an online apologetics and discernment work Apprising Ministries does not involve itself in politics per se; however, there are times when those issues will cross, as is the case with popular conservative talk show host Glenn Beck with his Divine Destiny event. Lately it’s becoming more apparent that Beck, who is a baptized member in good standing with the non-Christian cult of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (the Mormons), has been trying to portray himself as a Christian.

When you meet people from the LDS faith, they will often say to you: “We’re Christians too, because we believe in the Savior Jesus Christ.” However, the defining area concerning whether one is a Christian or not is what they teach concerning the historic Person Jesus of Nazareth, Whom the Bible teaches is the Christ—God Himself in human flesh.

Using the old TV show To Tell The Truth as a backdrop in Will The Real Jesus Please Stand Up? I used the benefit of my 23+ years in the study of Comparative Religion to “personalize” various Jesuses one is likely to encounter.

Following is the Mormon “Jesus” as he might introduce himself:

I am the Jesus Christ of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (the Mormons). My original Church went through a total apostasy and I took the Priesthood from the earth. In 1820 by one account—as there are nine different accounts—I appeared, with Heavenly Father, to Joseph Smith who would be the prophet to restore my Church. I told him that everything the historic Christian Church had taught was an abomination in my sight and that all who believe in those doctrines are corrupt. I am the spirit child who was born first to Heavenly Father, whose name is Elohim, and who has a body of flesh and bones as tangible as man’s.

Elohim was once a man who lived on the planet Kolob. He died and was resurrected by his father—after earning his way to godhood—as did his father before him, and so on back. Heavenly Father pro-created all of us through sexual relations with one of his celestial wives, and we are all his spirit children. I was born first; next was Lucifer, and then on down the line comes you. When the head of the gods—of which there are countless numbers—called a council of the gods I came up with a better plan of salvation than my brother Lucifer did. So I became the Savior for Heavenly Father’s children on earth. I was conceived for my earthly mission when Heavenly Father came down and had sexual relations with his daughter the Virgin Mary.

I sweat great drops of blood for your sins in the Garden of Gethsemane. Then on the cross I finished my work; and because of that atonement, all persons on this earth are going to be resurrected. And so now you have a chance to earn your way to becoming a god, just like me, by working the Gospel Principles taught by the Mormon Church. But be careful because my blood was not sufficient to cover some of your sins as my prophet Brigham Young once taught for me. He said, “There’s not a man or woman who violates the covenant made with their God that will not be required to pay that debt. The blood of Christ will never wipe that out. [And y]our own blood must atone for it.”

So the question we need to ask Glenn Beck is: Which Jesus Christ do you believe in; Jesus Christ of Nazareth—of the historic biblical record—or one of the myriad impostors; to further answer this question, below you can see for yourself what the Mormon Church, to which Glenn Beck belongs, actually teaches about Christ Jesus. Let us first consider this from Gospel Principles, which is an official publication of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.

The following comes from chapter 2:

God is not only our ruler and creator; he is also our Heavenly Father. “All men and women are . . . literally the sons and daughters of Deity. . . . Man, as a spirit, was begotten and born of heavenly parents, and reared to maturity in the eternal mansions of the Father, prior to coming upon the earth in a temporal [physical] body.” (Joseph F. Smith, “The Origin of Man,” Improvement Era, Nov. 1909, 78, 80)

Every person who was ever born on earth was our spirit brother or sister in heaven. The first spirit born to our heavenly parents was Jesus Christ (see D&C 93:21), so he is literally our elder brother (see Discourses of Brigham Young, p. 26). Because we are the spiritual children of our heavenly parents, we have inherited the potential to develop their divine qualities. If we choose to do so, we can become perfect, just as they are.
(Online source, emphasis mine)

And then in the next chapter we read:

We needed a Savior to pay for our sins and teach us how to return to our Heavenly Father. Our Father said, “Whom shall I send?” (Abraham 3:27). Two of our brothers offered to help. Our oldest brother, Jesus Christ, who was then called Jehovah, said, “Here am I, send me” (Abraham 3:27)… Satan, who was called Lucifer, also came, saying, “Behold, here am I, send me, I will be thy son, and I will redeem all mankind, that one soul shall not be lost, and surely I will do it; wherefore give me thine honor” (Moses 4:1).” (Online source, emphasis mine)

How about this from the book Our Search For Happiness–An Invitation To Understand The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints—written by Mormon Apostle M. Russell Ballard:

our spiritual selves, if you will — existed along with the rest of our Heavenly Father’s spirit children. Jesus was the greatest of these spirits. He was the first-[one]-born…and He held a special place of honor with the Father “before the world was”… In that capacity He helped implement the plan that would bring us all to earth to obtain physical bodies and experience the vicissitudes of mortality so we could grow in our ability to obey God’s commandments once we heard and understood them. (9, emphasis mine)

In the LDS book of “Scripture,” known as The Doctrine And Covenants, Jesus is alleged to have spoken this to the so-called prophet Joseph Smith, founder of the Mormon Church:

And now, verily I say unto you, I was in the beginning with the Father, and am the Firstborn; And all those through me are partakers of the glory of the same, and are of the church of the Firstborn. Ye were also in the beginning with the Father; that which is Spirit, even the Spirit of truth;… (93:21-23).

This is from the official website of the Mormon Church where we read:

Jess L. Christensen, Institute of Religion director at Utah State University, Logan, Utah. On first hearing, the doctrine that Lucifer and our Lord, Jesus Christ, are brothers may seem surprising to some—especially to those unacquainted with latter-day revelations. But both the scriptures and the prophets affirm that Jesus Christ and Lucifer are indeed offspring of our Heavenly Father and, therefore, spirit brothers. (Online source, emphasis mine)

And then finally Dr. Walter Martin (1928-1989) sums this post up well for us in the following from his classic textbook The Kingdom of the Cults when he points out that the “Jesus” of the LDS Church is clearly not the Christ of Biblical revelation:

The Savior of Mormonism, however, is an entirely different person, as their official publications clearly reveal. The Mormon “Savior” is not the second person of the Christian Trinity,… Mormons reject the Christian doctrine of the Trinity, and he is not even a careful replica of the New Testament Redeemer.

In Mormon theology, Christ as a preexistent spirit was not only the spirit brother of the devil (as alluded to in The Pearl of Great Price, Moses 4:1-4, and later reaffirmed by Brigham Young in the Journal of Discourses, 13:282), but celebrated his own marriage to “Mary and Martha, and the other Mary,” at Cana of Galilee, “whereby he could see his seed, before he was crucified” (Apostle Orson Hyde, Journal of Discourses, 4:259; 2:82)…[and] the Mormon concept of the Virgin Birth alone distinguishes their “Christ” from the Christ of the Bible. (252, emphasis mine)

Ken Silva

Associated links to read:

From Eric Barger: This is a pdf document with Eric Barger’s statement: http://www.ericbarger.com/An_Open_Letter_Concerning_Glenn_Beck.pdf

From Brannon Howse: Glenn Beck Rally Set Stage for “Christians” to Accept Paganism, and Mormons Say Beck Achieved 200 Year Goal of Getting Evangelicals to Declare That Mormons Are Christians

About these ads

27 responses to “We Cannot Compromise, Even For Nice Guys

  1. Manny,

    Thank you so much for sharing this. Last week I received an invite via Facebook to join an “8-28 prayer group”. I sent an e-mail back to the person who invited me, explaining that I couldn’t support the rally, since Beck never renounced his Mormon faith. She later posted on FB that Beck is a patriot who is standing for America, and we should support him regardless of our beliefs. This woman’s mother believes that Beck is a “born-again Mormon”. There are many sincere people out there who are being deceived by Glenn Beck and others like him. We need to pray for these people, and pray that God will continue to give us discernment and strength!

  2. Radio program In the Market with Janet Parshall had a great piece today about Glenn Beck. Though he invoked the name of God, he still states without question that he is a Mormon. When a well known personality brings up God and spirituality, you never hear them speak of Jesus Christ as the only way to God.

    John 14:6 has to be a key verse of discernment in this arena for people of faith. Make sure it’s the right Christian Faith.

    Brad

  3. Joanne,
    Thanks for sharing- God bless you. Discernment comes with a price sometimes- but we must stand firm even at the cost of losing a few friends sometimes, even family.
    May the Lord give you continued strength to stand for the truth.
    Manny

  4. interesting articles manny. i had actually wondered where you guys might fall with glenn beck with his particular mix of personal politics and religion. since it seems you and some of your more liberal opponents seem to share someone that you both have a problem with (for very different reasons of course), i would be very surprised to see much opposition on this particular post. Thanks again for the info.

  5. Ash,

    When Jesus is high and lifted up both “tax collectors” and “zealots” are at peace with each other. The gospel transcended politics in Jesus’ 1st century group of apostles during a time of fever pitched emotional enemy occupation by the god-less pagan Roman army.

    Matthew 10:2-4
    2These are the names of the twelve apostles: first, Simon (who is called Peter) and his brother Andrew; James son of Zebedee, and his brother John; 3Philip and Bartholomew; Thomas and Matthew the tax collector; James son of Alphaeus, and Thaddaeus; 4Simon the Zealot and Judas Iscariot, who betrayed him.

  6. pam,
    i appreciate your words. i really did not think my post would warrant any response as it was only to thank manny for the info but thanks all the same.

  7. Ash,
    I have read some of NazNet’s thoughts on the Glenn Beck issue- quite interesting. I was surprised to see for the first time, some of the NazNetters using the term heretic or heresy in reference to him. Had never really seen it used that way before.

  8. Yes, thanks for the link Gene. I stumbled on this earlier today, and although he speaks very eloquently, I cannot in the end agree with his rationalization for joining with Beck.

  9. Manny, I really appreciate you put Biblical faith above politics. It sounds obvious but so often, it seems people’s politics define their religion. You did well!

  10. Manny,

    I appreciate your highlighting this. I too have been concerned at the uncritical support that Beck is getting in his recent spiritual endeavors by evangelical Christians. I appreciate your pointing out that there is a difference here.

  11. Television and Radio host Todd Friel of the show Wretched said last night that Glenn Beck is a bigger danger to Christianity than the Emergent Church and Sensitive Seeker Movement. His ecumenical ways were pointed out quite plainly in the videos of last week’s rally in Washington D.C.

    II Cor. 6:14-15

    14 Be ye not unequally yoked together with unbelievers for what fellowship hath righteousness with unrighteousness? and what communion hath light with darkness?
    15 And what concord hath Christ with Belial? or what part hath he that believeth with an infidel?

    Brad

  12. Shreds and bits and pieces of information keep coming together to suggest a coherent whole. Did you know that Mormonism was started by a man who was involved in Free Masonry? Did you know that Free Masonry traces its roots back to Babylon through the Mystics of the early church and the Kaballah? Did you know that Theosophy, Jehovah’s Witnesses and Scientology were also all started by those involved with Free Masonry? Did you know that all of these groups claim direct revelation and all of them deny truths taught in scripture; especially about who Jesus is? Truly there is a war in the spiritual realm to which we are tied.

    “I am astonished that you are so quickly deserting him who called you in the grace of Christ and are turning to a different gospel— not that there is another one, but there are some who trouble you and want to distort the gospel of Christ. But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach to you a gospel contrary to the one we preached to you, let him be accursed. As we have said before, so now I say again: If anyone is preaching to you a gospel contrary to the one you received, let him be accursed.
    Galatians 1:6-9

    Clearly Paul is saying that we must know the gospel he first preached so that we would know if he was preaching contrary to it in the future or if anyone else, including an angel from heaven, did so as well. So it is not people (even someone like Paul) we are to trust, or spiritual beings we believe to be from heaven, but the Scriptures.

    Contemplative Centering Prayer opens up those who claim to be Christian to the very same spiritual influences that have guided the above movements and many other “religious traditions.” It is spirituality for the unregenerate and something that the Father of Lies is and has been attempting to supplant true spirituality with. Either you have the Holy Spirit or you don’t. Those who don’t cannot please God and live under the law of sin and death. Believing in the one whom the Father has sent is the only way to pass from death to life. If you love him you will obey him. That would be Jesus of Nazareth…not the Jesus of Joseph Smith of whom he learned from direct revelation from one claiming to be an angel known as Moroni to the Mormons.

  13. Welcome back, Clumsy. Appreciate your comments, and your screen name is one of my favorites- wish I had thought of it myself.

    You are right on with your thoughts on this- and what is frightening to me- from experience partly, is that the worst it seems to be getting, the same people we have been warning dig in with their heads in the sand even more- and stay entrenched in a mode of “nah, it’s not that bad. I’m not worried.” And I often hear this comment: “God is in control.” And those same people use this comment to excuse lack of action or necessity to warn and teach others of false prophets.

  14. I am in wholehearted agreement with you in regards to Mormon theology and their belief structure. (I’ve done exhaustive studies on it, especially living in an LDS community). They most certainly do believe in a ‘different’ Jesus than we (you and I and other orthodox Christian believers) worship. It is flat out heresy-doctrine and an occult.

    However, our American founding fathers stood arm-in-arm for Liberty & Freedom despite their backgrounds and beliefs – Christian, Jew, Atheist – they all understood the self-evident truths of Freedom.

    I do not align to Beck’s faith, but one cannot deny the political Truths he has brought to the forefront. It has certainly made me dig and dig and dig and dig deep into the heresies our own Nazarene church has delved into. NCM is a bedfellow to the Federal Government.

  15. The fact that Glenn Beck can step into the role of “Evangelical Leader” and be declared a “Born Again Christian” just shows how utterly blind the leadership in the church today is. If they can’t see that a Mormon is teaching another gospel how will they ever see the false teaching of those within the church? “I have decided that his doctrine is basically sound so I can now align myself with him.” We have seen this line of reasoning more than once lately….

  16. Tap. Tap. Is my mic not on? “Our American Founding Fathers stood arm-in-arm for Liberty & Freedom despite their backgrounds and beliefs – Christian, Jew, Atheist – they ALL understood the self-evident truths of Freedom.”

    We as true Christians need to defend everyone’s right to “freedom of Religion and the free exercise thereof” INCLUDING the Mormon. God gives us a choice to choose His narrow path (by confessing Jesus as Lord and believing on Him), does he not? While I vehemently disagree with the Mormon doctrine, I WILL defend the right for all Americans to have the freedom to choose their faith – ALL THE WHILE proclaiming the gospel of Jesus and He being the only Way, Truth and Life to the Father.

  17. I have one question in response to your comment, Betty, to which I absolutely agree with! Who has said here that they do not want Glenn Beck or anyone else to choose their faith? I certainly did not, and if you can point that out, I would appreciate it.

    You and I are on the same page, because I also I vehemently disagree with Mormonism also, because it is a false religion. But I strongly support the right of Glenn Beck to worship “another Jesus”, if that is his choice!

    So here’s my question: on that Friday’s Divine Destiny rally, would you have gone on stage and prayed to God right alongside with Glenn Beck as he prayed to God? And is your God the same one as Glenn Beck’s God?

    Ecumenism will be the destruction of true Christianity; that is my point here.

  18. I do not believe anyone has said that they disagree with those principles. However, I am questioning – at what point do we stand arm-in-arm? I think evangelical Christians have missed Glenn’s point by attacking his faith. I watched the Divine Destiny rally – Glenn did not pray. He invited evangelicals of OUR faith (yours and mine) to pray. AND, when we attended the American Revival in S.L.C. *he* did not pray. Now, who he prays to in his heart when he actually does pray? That’s for God to judge – we do not have any control over that.

    Yes, we need to be cautious and conscientious of his influence and pray that God keeps him humble in his powerful leadership of influence. I will be the very first to speak loudly about ANY fallacies of his taking advantage of his position to lead others astray to his faith, but I have not seen evidence of him doing that. Glenn’s point in uniting Americans is that it is impossible to have morality in a nation without religion.

    For the last few years I have been *praying* for Glenn and actually praying for someone to come into his life who he would have a trust relationship/fellowship with that could have the knowledge with love to share with Glenn the truth of the doctrine he follows. And look what’s happened? David Barton, a steadfast evangelical has come into his life – someone that Glenn Beck is now calling one of his best friends. We need to PRAY for this man – especially as a brother in Christ. He, too, has come under severe attack.

    We need to unite as Americans on the principles of Liberty and Freedom and by the witness of our Faith lead others to the cross.

    YES, I would have gone on stage and prayed to the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob in the name of Jesus Christ because my motives would have been pure, as they are now – I KNOW who I am praying to. What do you think Billy Graham did? He stood on a stage and prayed before a crowd of people – many of them unbelievers. Was he responsible for their prayers?

    On that note – I am not a Theologian, but I am (was?) a Nazarene who is taking a FIRM stand against the sweeping wave of false teaching within our church denomination. I have documented 1000’s of pages of false teaching and am getting prepared to launch them.

    Thank you for your steadfastness on this – so many are being led astray.

  19. Thanks Betty,

    I certainly pray that David Barton will be a great witness to Glenn, and perhaps through that witness, Glenn Beck will come to know the real Jesus.

    Please let me know when you send out any of your information, I would be glad to read it. We need as many Christians as possible in this fight against false teaching.
    Blessings,
    Manny

  20. Let me also add that the very thing that was holding up the Constitutional Convention was arguing over the disagreements of doctrine… people could not see what unified them (Americanism). Until Ben Franklin called for prayer on the floor and they fasted and prayed for three days did the miracle of the Constitution actually begin to process peacefully. It was a miracle. ;)

  21. Hey Betty,

    The only problem I have is this: praying alongside Glenn Beck as he prays to his God, gives the appearance of condoning and making the “God” or “Jesus” he worships, to be the same God as the real God and Jesus of the Bible.

    I will stand with Glenn Beck on American issues of basic freedom and constitutional rights- but will draw the line when he brings his Mormon “Jesus” to an ecumenical gathering as it is what it seemed to be on Friday.

    But I won’t try to hit you over the head with this, so I’ll let you have the last word on it if you wish. We are on the same side as far as the nasty battle with false teaching, for me to keep going on about it with you. I do hope you understand my thoughts on that. I understand yours as well and I appreciate it.

    Hey, maybe when I preach my sermon in a few weeks on ecumenism, you’ll get a better understanding of where I am coming from. (I’m not a “real” preacher, by the way; just doing a guest sermon. :-)

  22. I have enjoyed this dialogue very much and look forward to your sermon. I’ve been reading your site for some time (not commented until now, as you know ;) ) and had ZERO knowledge of the emergent church until this last March (when Glenn Beck called for people to research their church for ‘social justice’). WHOA! Were my eyes ever opened to what is happening within our denomination. My husband and I have taken it upon ourselves to document everything we have found. How grieved we are. And, yet – when we look around, it’s sadly sweeping many denominations. Much of our research has overlapped with yours without realizing, but the more we can help with the firm stand, the better.

    As I’ve been working today I’ve been rhetorically thinking, ‘why is it, as a general rule, that the emergent church is steering the ship towards global governance ultimately standing opposed to the very foundation for which America was founded?’

    I haven’t come up with an answer yet – what do you think about that?

  23. Hi Betty,
    My short answer to that is: one world religion leading to the anti-christ, as foretold in scripture. My best guess. This ecumenical spirit is reflected in that I believe.

    Interestingly, I stumbled on this tonight just before I was going to answer:

    http://www.discerningtheworld.com/2010/07/13/final-preparations-to-receive-the-new-age-christ/

    A short excerpt from it, by Prof. Johan Malan:

    Ecumenism.
    It is generally believed that religious globalism holds the key to the revelation of God’s kingdom on earth and a future of unity, prosperity and peace to divided humanity. Within this approach the fragmentation of Christianity into many denominations (referred to as vintage Christianity) should be countered by establishing mega-churches without strict and very explicit creeds, and without standing strong on the inerrancy of the Bible. Mega-churches should merge into post-denominational city churches that function under the guidance of prophets and apostles. Regional, national and international ties should then be forged among the various local branches of the church. Collective actions such as transformation rallies or meditation meetings are believed to wield the spiritual power needed to overcome evil and change the destiny of societies. This is New Age philosophy. They believe that when a critical mass (a representative group of people who believe they are divine) comes together to meditate, the scale will swing away from evil and divisiveness, draw humanity into this oneness, and heal the world.

    The uniting of the Christian church is only an interim objective which paves the way towards multireligious ecumenical ties – an alliance of world religions in which the members of all faiths join hands on the premise that they worship the same God. It stands to reason that if they believe they worship the same God, they are also awaiting the same, universal Christ to finally unite them. When he has come, no insubordination will be tolerated and all people will be obliged to worship him (cf. Rev. 13:3-4,8,15).

    Ecumenically-minded preachers of deceived mega-churches are preparing the way for the coming universal Christ of the New Age Movement. The vagueness of their creeds, the ignorance of their members, and the strong impact of postmodern thinking allows them to present another Jesus who, in many respects, differs from the biblical Jesus. Without much resistance they unwittingly make Jesus conformable to the New Age Jesus, simply by denying His uniqueness, the redemptive significance of His cross, and His insistence on repentance. They only emphasise His mission to bless and unite all people, to inspire them to realise their full potential so as to prosper in everything they do, and to empower them to establish and extend the kingdom of God on earth.

    However, where there are still significant numbers of evangelical Christians, like in the US and South Africa, ecumenically-minded theologians first engage in a relentless campaign to slander and discredit the biblical Jesus by reducing Him to a historical Jesus who was just one of many human prophets. After that, their spiritually uprooted and disillusioned followers will be introduced to the cosmic Jesus of the emerging New World Order, thereby drawing them into the multireligious structures of the ecumenical movement.

Comments are closed.